Sunday, June 17

War with the Bureacracy of Scholars

So we're at war with EVE University (Ivy League), something that I have been a the most vocal opponent of in r1fta traditionally. It had been raised as an option in the past but we always decided against it.

I need to do a little bit of a background story on the Heild area for the rest of this post to make sense so I shall. About 6 or 7 months ago r1fta decided we needed a system not so much to have the entire corp live in (around 70% of the corp is highly nomadic) but to use a central point for doing corp stuff from and hold events and such in. We picked Heild in Molden Heath.
Our nest-builders started living there and over time a beautiful thing happened, Heild became a frigate fight club. Our neighbours in Bosena (Gunpoint Diplomacy) started coming in for fights so did several other entities in the area; The Executioners, Point of Dispute, some regular Tusker & Repo tourists and some others too. We all shot each other and were more or less civil about it, lots of explosions no hard feelings no grudges. It was a lot of fun.
Sure it attracted some bads too who were more interested in 'winning at all costs and 10 to 1 killboard stats' then in having a good fun brawl. Basically we ignored them or on occasion formed up with the other fight club people like RANSM to smash a gate camp or engineer a fight or some such. Leading to hilarious accusations of us being a bluefest on several occasions (both ransm & texn are in fact set -5 to us).

Fast forward to last week when E-UNI moved their lowsec camp into Heild, and not just into Heild but into our ancestral home station. Which is a shitty spit-out station that's terrible for capital logistics.

Now originally I responded to this by shrugging and moving elsewhere as for sometime I had found that Molden Heath was a little to small/underpopulated for our number of dudes & dudettes in frigates. So I had planned on leaving a jump clone there and moving down when I felt like a bit of fight clubbing. While roaming solo up north and specifically nullsec a little more. My plans just got shifted into a higher gear when the unista's moved in.

Apparently though the University didn't feel like fight clubbing and seemed to enjoy camping the station undock and the gates and dropping 6 or 7  people including ecm on single frigates. Really quite annoying.
RANSM meanwhile started fighting the unista's in more organized gangs, a couple of our dudes joined in. As I understand it the university despite still vastly outnumbering them, would only engage on gates and stations. So RANSM did the logical thing and removed station and gate guns from the equation by going to war with Ivy league. We had some guys flying in the gunpoint gangs, their CEO talked to our CEO and we went to war with Ivy League too, TEXN then did the same.

By Joe Struck

So that's how the conflict originated. But then Ivy League responded the way they do to all wardecs, and decided to try and bully us into dropping the wardecs by threatening to 'bring all of their duders down and camp us in'. Which is a strategy that has allways worked for them in the past when dealing with hisec griefer wardecs. And they seem quite convinced will work now. But it won't.

Usually their strategy works well because when dealing with some hisec griefers just making it hard for them to play will make them stop eventually. And most hisec griefers are interested in shiny kills and worry about silly stuff like their killboard stats and losses. Well we here in r1fta give exactly 0 fucks about losses, if our killboard efficiency was 1% but were getting into 'gud fights' erryday we'd be just fine with that despite apparently losing them all. We're all about fights and the hunt not about stats.
So far almost three days in uni's blob sitting in the Heild area has not affected our gameplay at all. Those of us that want to help with the 'war effort' have rallied around that cause and are doing just that. Some people with shinier security status have relished in the new ocean of hisec targets and are having a blast with it. Our brave solo warriors are off solo'ing and our wolf packs are out prowling, business as usual pretty much. Our esteemed leader, who's loathing for Eve University runs quite deep by way, is off flying solo in nullsec somewhere.
And the uni? They're sitting in Heild occasionally undocking to shoot at something when they feel their risk of loss is low.

By Peri Simone

Another thing I found quite intriguing is a line of responses by unista's including their CEO Kelduum on various blog, forums post and tweets, saying we should just come and talk to them and we'll  arrange blues or some such or we should have read their wiki and we would have known (even if we did know -and we did- we would still have decced you and so we did indeed).
Uhm, excuse me come again? Did you just say; "if you just adjust your corp culture to ours and play by our rules their wouldn't be an issue!" Because it sure sounded like you just did, is my name Neville Chamberlain or someting? Which part of the word Rebel in our corp name do I need to clarify exactly?
We're not in Ivy league and I have absolutely nothing to do with your 'WSOP' or 'Open NAP' policy. I'm in r1fta and our policy is 'no blues' there's only one exception (Black Frog Logistics) and there won't be any other exceptions, not now not ever for as far as I'm concerned.

So the way we see this the unista's can either adjust to the fight club style of play in the area, god forbid you might actually learn something from solo and small wolfpack frigate fights.
Move out of Heild to a neighbouring system and stop camping Heild stations and gates so we can move around without dealing with camps, Atlar is nearby (and not already inhabited and has direct hisec access) Oddeluf & Istodard is are nice systems too. We'd be happy to come and fight you regularly with small stuff some other pirate corps might be quite willing to bring bigger stuff on occasion. You can be stubborn and keep a blob in Heild and not adjust. In which case the wardec stays until your lowsec camp moves on, weeks, months a year it's fine by us, bank rolling it won't be an issue.

By Joe Struck


  1. I think the core of our message is that communicating with us would have been preferable to wardeccing us, saying "gtfo of Molden Heath or we'll force you out" and expecting us to react any differently than we have done.

    If anybody on your side wants to talk this over at some point, I'd certainly be interested in doing so.

    1. You're quite welcome to stay in Molden Heath. But understand we r1fta is a frigate corp, we're not interested in fighting your 30 man fleets we'd be happy to skirmish your dudes in small gangs *without* e-war we're even willing to do so in 2vs1 odds etc to make up for the SP difference (though plenty of guys/girls are as young as your pilots). The reason we never came to Dudreda much is the on time we did our 10 rifters got smashed by by 20 cruisers with a ton of e-war, we took the hint.

      We're not cool with you moving into the planet 10 station and camping gates and undocks interfering with our ability move ships arounds and shooting our own 3 month old nublets without any chance for them to fight.

      I fail to see why we should have come to you to talk however, we were in Molden Heath in that station already. If at any time uni would have approached and asked how would you feel about us moving 30 people semi-permanently into Molden Heath to join the fight club we would have said; Sure! Great! Pick a station in Egbinger/Atlar/Anywhere that doesn't already have a ton of us living in it and there'd be more face in the fight club. We don't even mind shooting first for as long as it's on planets/belts (frigates don't respond well to gate guns).

      Other then that Molden Heath is very much a community and it would help relation tremendously if your guys could chat with us in local etc. Trust me RANSM says meaner thing to us then your guys would and we still get along fine with them.

      But none of that happened one day we log in and find 30-50 unista's living in the planet 10 station shooting our dudes and refusing to adapt even one inch to the pre-existing eco system of the area.

    2. The Uni left the Hagilur pocket because no one wanted to fight the Uni blob any longer. The pocket, once a thriving area for lowsec piracy, became a wasteland of inactivity, due to the Uni unwilling and unable to adapt to any style of warfare other than blobbing their targets to death.

      (The Uni blobs, because ISK efficiency is *everything* to Kelduum. Their campaign page is nothing but an ISK efficiency wank.)

      So now they move on elsewhere, to bring the only PvP they're capable of teaching their newbies, to a new area of lowsec.


      It's the height of hypocrisy for them to suggest that people must contact them for gudfites, but they don't contact a soul before moving into Heild. "Hey, we're here! *blob*"

    3. I don't think the move to Molden Heath was something the leadership intended ahead of time. The low-sec folk we asked to leave Dudreda (Space Police war-dec caused too many complaints it seems) and a more senior member picked Molden Heath as a place to move to while the corp worked out what was going to happen next.

      From the outside it looks like the existing MH residents have a fair point and E-UNI should move to another system.

    4. The issue with that is, the LSC is just tired already from being told to move, the LSC might as well be more of a separate entity altogether with what you're dealing with, the personalities are much different than most of the management. trust me when I say that the new influx of players into your area would have been much much smaller had the war not been declared.

      War bothers most of the UNI more than anything else, and while I respect your reasoning for decing us, and understand completely the need to avoid gate/station guns the dec will never help the balance of things. there are currently 80 unistas, and about 40 of them are normal LSC members, and even more coming down every day because of this war.

      Hell the way you describe it, it sounds amazing actually, I'd love to try it that way, but with the current amount of wars against the UNI specifically LSC I don't see that happening anytime soon.

      We currently have about 5 wars running against us, LSC revels in it, we are proud of our wars. The rest of the uni however disagrees the Care-bears are 95% of the uni it seems.

      And they're the one's that are finally being brought into pvp thanks to the recent wars. that's a plus, but I would have preferred the smaller gang pvp, there are no big fights to be had like with RVB you guys aren't a threat to our POS or anything neat like that and I hate that, I hate that we outnumber you 10 to 1 on any of the fights that we have. most of the LSC is bored with that shit anyway.

      I have a feeling when the wardec stops, IF the wardec stops, things might change. If not I don't know what will happen.

    5. I started talking to 'uni command' yesterday, we'll see where it leads. Not much more that can be done right now.

      One of the reasons I feel this escalated the way it did, is because we can't communicate to members of the lowsec camp directly.
      Yes there's local smack from our guys sometimes, pirates gonna pirate and all that. But there's usually plenty of smack and posturing between the local pirates to, yet we get along more or less fine most of the time.
      Molden Heath beyond and area of space is also very much a community and that has a dynamic all it's own.

  2. I believe the core of our (the greater MH pirate community) has been missed. There's really nothing to discuss, & we really arent interested in you GTFO. By all means, please stay. We're perfectly fine shooting you whilest we shoot all the other things in the area. ;)

  3. Ohyea, & welcome to beautiful Molden Heath.

    P.S. our beaches are shit and our women dont shave.

  4. You camp people into their home station, you're asking for a dec. No question. Viva la resistance!

    -A neutral observer

  5. As long as you threaten the highsec assets of the uni, they have absolutely no reason to fight fair with you. The uni is an educational facility for all aspects of the game, and while you are a threat, they have to respond in kind. Talk to them, you may even be able to get them to agree to an informal set of engagement terms.

    1. They have 2000 members, of which 200-400 are actual students/newbies. I've never been to any educational institution that had a 10:1 ratio of staff to students.

      The more likely scenario is that the Uni is a haven to old, high-SP carebears, and they just happen to teach newbies. Most of those carebears do nothing but earn ISK. They don't teach, they don't mentor, they are wastrels.

    2. The University came into our house and pissed into our cereal before we wardecced them. How that helps their educational programme is beyond me. It's a blatant act of aggression and not something a truly neutral entity would do. If that isn't a Casus Belli then what is?

      And them acting like victims of an aggressive wardec is ridiculous. How would you feel when when a blob 3 or 4 times the size of what you can reliably field moved into Aldrat and then started blowing up your dudes without warning?

  6. This post just makes me wish I was fighting with you guys :(

    Good luck killing them, they're cunts from my experience fighting them

  7. From your blog entry it sounds as though your happy with the situation as it "does not affect your gameplay at all". The uni is also happy with the situation. The guys in the camp hope the war lasts as long as possible. So, happy days all round then? You keep deccing and we'll keep fisting! :)

    1. Really that's an interesting stance from a unista. Since the Universty claims to be a neutral entity. So first you move into somebodies home station and then you start shooting them.
      After that when you get wardecced you claim you are the 'victim' of an aggressive wardec and also start banging you chest going 'BRING IT, BRING IT' on the blog of director of the hostile corporation.
      Not the kind of behaviour one would expect from 'a strictly neutral educational corporation'.

  8. The Uni lowsec camp moves on after a few months at most, always has. So even if you ignore it, it would go away. Although, who could pass on a situation to shoot Unistas?

    But it is rare to see R1fta in a defensive position. I have alot more faith in you than the Unistas, despite the difference in blob size. However, I would refrain from giving Kelduum and the lolpack the satisfaction of responses on Twitter, especially negative ones. A complete stop of communication and pure autocannon talk would leave no room for interpretation.

    Change hulls, and fight accordingly. Not possible in frigates though, I smell big artillery.

    (Now if I could find enough time to escape this stupid wormhole I could join that fight, and I know I want to!)